Even if you are right I’ll take doing the right thing for the wrong reasons over the fucking disappointment and self destruction coming from the United States.
Doesn’t matter how you spin it, China is objectively better for the world right now.
You can feel morally superior all the way to societal collapse
You’re right in that the whole drill-baby-drill thing is utter self-destruction which may still work passably over the course of the next four years but not beyond. The IRA right now is solid industrial policy and I wish us Europeans were competing. (Wild guess though, the repeal of the IRA will go much like the repeal of the ACA last time around.)
However, my point is that China is in a phase where it’s doing more with more, and its motivation is such that that will stay that way. The only reason Chinese emissions are stagnating right now is that their economy is faltering. At this point, the Jevons paradox is simply eating their renewable power/electric car/… gains. Granted, that is preferable to them continuing to buy ever more fossil-fueled cars.
The motivation for producing this technology will, to a degree, determine the outcome: Solar panels off Temu, delivered to your doorstep using a fossil-fueled plane are a thing that exists.
What happens when the importing blocs (US and EU) rethink their climate policy (because right-wing morons think that’s a good idea)? Chinese products will adapt quickly.
When the people in China can go outside in public without wearing filtration masks I’ll consider start taking their environmental approaches more seriously.
What century are you from? The localized pollution problems you’re referring to have been resolved. I know you won’t trust any source anyone here provides, so go ahead and look it up. Just because you got used to your government being useless and slow, doesn’t mean other governments are the same.
we in the western civilization are usually getting paid for our work and don’t consider that as discreditation of said work.
also, the author of the book, is, among others, researcher at Harvard, so he is the literal scientist.
Michael Pillsbury is the director of the Center on Chinese Strategy at the Hudson Institute and has served in presidential administrations from Richard Nixon to Barack Obama. Educated at Stanford and Columbia Universities, he is a former analyst at the RAND Corporation and research fellow at Harvard and has served in senior positions in the Defense Department and on the staff of four U.S. Senate committees. He is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations and the International Institute for Strategic Studies. He lives in Washington, D.C.
Buddy is a Western Patriot fighting the good fight. Go get em tiger, your emotional zeal is steadfast in the face of data and logic. America is truly amazing and the best at climate. You caught a vuvuzelan spy working for Xi.
How is it appropriate to make comparisons between nations without normalizing for the population?
when you have big part of country that is rural and don’t participate in generating the emissions and profiting from them, then including them in the total count to artificially decrease final per capita number is just manipulation.
but my point here was you carefully selected one graph and presented it without context to support incorrect conclusion. but you know that, right?
Frankly, accusing me of manipulation makes me no longer care what you have to say. You can fuck off.
so you have no rebuttal to graphs i showed you, so you are suddenly not talking to me. that’s understandable, whatever exit strategy works for you, clown…
You’re here being an asshole with a chip on your shoulder so I’m giving you the same energy. Comparing the total output of a 2 billion pop nation with a nation 20% of that size is a pretty dumb way to compare statistics and the progress of a country’s green transition.
I can’t give you a stats curriculum on lemmy when you are also being a huge dick.
Even if you are right I’ll take doing the right thing for the wrong reasons over the fucking disappointment and self destruction coming from the United States.
Doesn’t matter how you spin it, China is objectively better for the world right now.
You can feel morally superior all the way to societal collapse
Tbh, doesn’t feel good pinning hopes on China, but I’ll take what I can get at this point.
You’re right in that the whole drill-baby-drill thing is utter self-destruction which may still work passably over the course of the next four years but not beyond. The IRA right now is solid industrial policy and I wish us Europeans were competing. (Wild guess though, the repeal of the IRA will go much like the repeal of the ACA last time around.)
However, my point is that China is in a phase where it’s doing more with more, and its motivation is such that that will stay that way. The only reason Chinese emissions are stagnating right now is that their economy is faltering. At this point, the Jevons paradox is simply eating their renewable power/electric car/… gains. Granted, that is preferable to them continuing to buy ever more fossil-fueled cars.
The motivation for producing this technology will, to a degree, determine the outcome: Solar panels off Temu, delivered to your doorstep using a fossil-fueled plane are a thing that exists.
What happens when the importing blocs (US and EU) rethink their climate policy (because right-wing morons think that’s a good idea)? Chinese products will adapt quickly.
lol
ok educate me. On the topic of climate in which ways has (or will) the United States be better? I’d appreciate the optimistic perspective.
Does the argument extend beyond China bad?
When the people in China can go outside in public without wearing filtration masks I’ll consider start taking their environmental approaches more seriously.
What you’re bringing up, even if true, would be explained equally well by population density.
China’s per capita emissions are lower than the US and Canada https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-per-capita/
They’re also innovating and leading in solar technology and cheap EVs.
You’re pointing at subjective and anecdotal “evidence” where are your hard stats?
What century are you from? The localized pollution problems you’re referring to have been resolved. I know you won’t trust any source anyone here provides, so go ahead and look it up. Just because you got used to your government being useless and slow, doesn’t mean other governments are the same.
here, educate yourself: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/20696000-the-hundred-year-marathon
when your argument is “china good”, then “china bad” absolutely is valid rebuttal.
Do you have any real sources, like scientific sources, anything written by someone not intending to get paid massive amounts for their work?
well hello there, chinese intelligence officer.
we in the western civilization are usually getting paid for our work and don’t consider that as discreditation of said work. also, the author of the book, is, among others, researcher at Harvard, so he is the literal scientist.
Michael Pillsbury is the director of the Center on Chinese Strategy at the Hudson Institute and has served in presidential administrations from Richard Nixon to Barack Obama. Educated at Stanford and Columbia Universities, he is a former analyst at the RAND Corporation and research fellow at Harvard and has served in senior positions in the Defense Department and on the staff of four U.S. Senate committees. He is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations and the International Institute for Strategic Studies. He lives in Washington, D.C.
Buddy is a Western Patriot fighting the good fight. Go get em tiger, your emotional zeal is steadfast in the face of data and logic. America is truly amazing and the best at climate. You caught a vuvuzelan spy working for Xi.
How did treating all dissent as Russian/Chinese bots/trolls work out this election? Not very well. Because they mostly don’t exist.
China’s per capita carbon emissions are lower than the United States and Canada https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-per-capita/
oh, cool. manipulation by carefully selecting statistisc that will support my theory 😂
first, there is a lot more to “being good/better for the world” than co2 emissions per capita.
with that out of hand, lets look at few others, shall we?
https://ourworldindata.org/co2/country/china
How is it appropriate to make comparisons between nations without normalizing for the population?
Frankly, accusing me of manipulation makes me no longer care what you have to say. You can fuck off.
when you have big part of country that is rural and don’t participate in generating the emissions and profiting from them, then including them in the total count to artificially decrease final per capita number is just manipulation.
but my point here was you carefully selected one graph and presented it without context to support incorrect conclusion. but you know that, right?
so you have no rebuttal to graphs i showed you, so you are suddenly not talking to me. that’s understandable, whatever exit strategy works for you, clown…
You’re here being an asshole with a chip on your shoulder so I’m giving you the same energy. Comparing the total output of a 2 billion pop nation with a nation 20% of that size is a pretty dumb way to compare statistics and the progress of a country’s green transition.
I can’t give you a stats curriculum on lemmy when you are also being a huge dick.