Western brands don’t care cause they just lobby to ban them from the west.
It’s not just brands that should fear it, but also people living in cities. Say no to SUVs, even if you “sometimes go to camping, once or twice a year” (yeah, that’s the justification for everyone buying them).
All Western car makers are already shitting themselves because of Chinese cars. Have been for at least a few years now.
Even Ford’s CEO openly said that Chinese EVs are better, more technologically advanced, and cheaper than Western cars. He also said that after driving a Xiaomi car for 6 months he doesn’t want to go back to Western cars.
Again, this is the CEO of Ford.
Sources:
Looks like Rolls-Royce Cullinan from China.
Thanks for the ad. I really needed it.
Given the quality of some of their cheaper cars, this is a probably a shitbox.
You mean “their” as in general to the whole Chinese car industry including the shitboxes sold by GM under the Buick brand? Or only Xiaomi cars?
Because Xiaomi exclusively sells luxury cars, their other “cheaper” model costs $35k, maybe you are confused for another brand?
Do you work for the company? Jebus.
Can we just fucking STOP doing SUVs please? And huge trucks. And all the rest of that oversized garbage.
But I like being able to see over everyone else
- everyone
At this point I’m planning to see under everyone else.
Xiaomi first car is an amazing sport sedan: SU7. Followed by my personal favorite, the YU7. Actually the SU7 has been the best selling car in China for a few months.
The Skynomad, this new SUV, strangely is not marketed as Xiaomi but purely as Skynomad. They have separate stores, whereas the SU7 and YU7 are in the normal Xiaomi stores, between the phones fridges and laptops. Definitely a different target audience so that could be the strategy. It doesn’t have a Xiaomi badge either.
The same goes for Huawei, who have a whole suit of different models and types of cars. The most insane one, from innovation perspective, is the Maestro, a competitor for Rolls-Royce.
I suspect they wanted a new brand for their non-EVs so it wouldn’t dilute the Xiaomi brand? This one is a plug-in hybrid in reality, though the technical term is EREV as you can’t drive on the petrol engine, it only charges the battery
All serious car manufacturers do this. Do you think Lexus, Infiniti, et al are their own brands?
I’m a car nut so yes I’m very aware and knowledgeable. However Lexus is Toyota which is a well established brand for many decades before they branched out. The same with Infinity.
Xiaomi is just starting out making cars for 3 years now, only have 2 models, and should work on their own brand first, before creating a new brand. The market in China in EV’s is already extremely competitive. So introducing another brand, just is complicated for the consumer. Xiaomi is such an established brand here, keep it under that banner.
And the Skynomad is nothing special or high end luxury. That was my point. Build your brand first and in due time, create the spinoff if needed. Now in China, everything is accelerated but still.
But without SUVs, people would be embarrassed driving minivans and without huge trucks, there would be nothing to compensate for small penises.
Bring on an era where minivans are cool again, SUVs are tacky, and hot hatches + coupes reign supreme.
I want a mostly analog microbus body on a kei size frame. Standardized universal plug ins with easily swappable parts. Basically easily accessible media/electronic wiring internally where we can swap the wiring harness, speakers and receiver. A standard sized motor slot for each wheel and same for battery slot and hookups. If new battery technology comes out, they make it to fit the same size slot with adapters pre-fit so no modifications are needed.
If a motor goes bad set to a temporary mode where all power goes to front or back wheel depending on which died… drive into shop lift car, put on standardized lift… Mechanic knows where full shut off switch is that disconnects battery from all components, lift already grounds frame by setup and pulling the bolts removing the motor and swapping it with a standardized replacement should be able to be done in minutes. The mechanic shouldn’t need to know much at that point, but still good to have someone who does multiple a day than someone who does 1 every 7-10 years.
Universal light sockets blah blah blah.
So if you want “smart” features, they are in your chosen swappable part, Bluetooth, wifi, CD, 8-track, whatever, your choice, your slots. Obviously, 8 track might not fit but if everything is standardized, accessory hookups become easy to make
That would be ideal; something of an Open Platform with fully interchangeable parts.
It’s not quite fully everything we’d want, but that Slate truck that was announced (launched?) last year seems like it’s a step in the right direction.
The issue at play largely is that customer demand needs to make such options not only viable for manufacturers - but an outright requirement in order for them to remain competitive and relevant.
To me I thought telos started right, then fucked themselves.
Gen X shoulda boughta fucking wagon like their parents.
I’m Genx. No kids still at home. I got a minivan (6 cyl Grand Caravan) and will keep having a minivan because they’re versatile as fuck. I’m on my 3rd right now. They’re comfortable to drive long distances, handle well in the snow, and have buttons for controls instead of a touch screen.
Haul 8 people. No problem. Haul 4x8 sheets of plywood. No problem. Camp in the back. No problem. Move a couch. No problem. Haul a small camper or trailer. No problem.
I fold the seats and slide in a sheet of 1/2 inch 4x8 plywood in the back to make loading/unloading easy.
They’re cheap too. You can pick one up just a few years old for a few thousand.
nothing to compensate for small penises.
That’s not true!!! Just about everything that a mid-life crisis covers, can be a compensation for a small penis.
Most of these these new SUVs aren’t huge SUVs of the 90s - like Ford Explorer. They’re basically the new station wagon but barely larger than a sedan like a Camry.
A crossover is a station wagon but the entire thing is raised up for no reason. It’s funny how averse the public is to driving a minivan. I drove one as a rental for a week and it was snappy, convenient, comfortable, and could hold a ton of stuff or people.
Minivans’ case isn’t really helped here in Europe by the fact that they’re cheap econoboxes with 2 liter or smaller engines. The Chrysler minivan with its V6 is just about the only exception. And the Mercedes one, but that hasn’t been available in well over a decade. We don’t get the Sienna or the Odyssey for example.
American need a husky fit vehicle.
I think people who have never driven one or feel uncomfortable getting one and gets one because they feel they’re getting more for their money shouldn’t be driving them at all.
I think people who want one should rent one that way they have practice and they have to be careful with the vehicle because it’s on loan but the one thing I noticed when just about everyone switched to mini-suv’s and full sized ones and trucks, that there’s more people who have never driven one in their life and it’s noticeable.
I just don’t want to be hit by someone who has no idea how to manage driving one because of their size and depth perception being thrown off other than that who gives a fuck what people drive. If someone wants to drop money on something stupidly oversized and uses a fuckload of gas, let em.
No
Not in the US. We have a captive market that keeps us from ever seeing one.
An SUV for that price… In sure Chinese sweatshop factory workers are paid fairly and work in safe conditions and get regular breaks, vacations, aock leave, etc… Right?
Because if not, you’d be buying products from slavery yet somehow I don’t see that argument very much
So, instead of Chinese robot slavery, buy from American or Mexican human slavery?
but American slaves were convicted!
Mostly of being not white, but you know . . .
America has UAW, which is about a quarter of the reason American cars are so expensive. They’re paying their factory workers way too much.
Auto factories are well known for providing above average working conditions and career paths for their workers in China (high skill, robots). This is one product you would want to buy to support worker rights in China which notoriously have almost no rights or representstion.
I’m not sure. There was a guy on Lemmy saying essentially that the “wages are actually pretty good in auto manufacturing, but of course you have to do 60+ hours a week for them to be good, not be lazy and do 40” from his own experience in China.
60+ hours is kinda the norm in China though
Show me a car without the Chinese components or the Chinese labor involved in its manufacture?
Not denying sweatshops over there, but it’s highly likely these are mostly built by robots in empty buildings.
Yeah. Watched a factory tour and assembly for sany equipment. Excavators and such. There’s people involved. But the facilities are clean automated and far from sweat shop looking. They make damn good equipment. I used to think it’s junk. Then I had to fix a couple. Impressive stuff from those guys.
Removed video.
Got a source on this claim?
An suv we cant buy
If only you guys had democracy
Yeah great, I’ll pass on the CCP/PLA owned automobile companies.
I prefer domestic exploitation to the Chinese.
If the billionaires raping my life and my country are American, they are welcome. If they are Chinese, then fuck the CCP.
Thankfully in the US we won’t get the choice because they’re not allowed to sell here to protect our domestic producers from competition so we can just give them more money the next time they need to be bailed out.
They pretty much do the same in China. Tesla I believe is or was the only foreign manufacturer allowed to own their Chinese business. Everyone else had to set up a Chinese subsidiary majority owned by a Chinese automaker.
Nothing stopping Xiaomi from doing the same with Ford or GM in the US as far as I know?
US auto makers have done such things before. For a few years, GM sold the Chevy Luv which was a rebadged Izuzu. Ford has done the same with Volkswagon and others.
They’ll be banned faster than you can memorize the spelling of Xiaomi. At least in the US, where we make sure the old inefficient companies stay afloat despite their incompetence.
Chinese cars are heavily subsidized by the state. The reason they’re so cheap is because China bets it can squeeze the competition out of the market before charging basically whatever they want.
I’ve seen Starbucks do the same thing to independent coffee shops.
Edit: This is a post about real car companies like Nissan, Volvo, Mercedes, Renault, whatever. I don’t care about America. Nobody has for decades.
American car companies (and American built cars) get subsidies from the US, Canada, and Mexico as all three form a single manufacturing chain. They simply have had a different set of priorities that allowed newcomers to eat their lunch, like it happens to any complacent industry.
Chinese cars are heavily subsidized by the state. The reason they’re so cheap is because China bets it can squeeze the competition
Used to be, to get them going, robotics, innovation and vertical integration is most of the reason now. An example, BYD have their own roro ships and have ordered another 10,
https://www.whichcar.com.au/news/byd-orders-10-more-car-carriers-export-push-accelerates
and the new ships will be built in China
they make their own batteries, electric motors etc and have massive robotic assembly plants.
To suggest the reason why is because it’s not a level playing field is ludicrous, the US spends many billions subsidizing car manufacturers on top of the billions us consumers spend in subsidizing them. directly.
Chinese cars are heavily subsidized by the state
Detroit has received $88B in subsidies and loans since 2008. That’s why we have so many cheap EV options?
Heavily subsidized by misery, as well.
Detroit pays union wages and has to respect worker rights (at the top end of the supply chain). The “communist “ state seems to escape these limited obligations in big parts of their supply chains.
Workers in Detroit might get paid union wages, but many auto factories have relocated to the South where they can underpay and abuse workers much more easily. I just did some quick googling and it seems like being a factory worker in China isn’t bad compared to in the US. They work in highly automated, clean, air-conditioned spaces like would be found here. Dirty conditions and manual labor are no longer compatible with today’s automotive quality requirements. Low level workers make modest wages, but they employ a bunch of engineers and technicians just like here in the US, and they have subsidized cafeterias and some provide housing or stipends for housing. You might criticize the expectation of working significant overtime, but I’ve worked in factories which had mandatory overtime in the US, so that sort of structural coercion isn’t unique to China. Compared to a “right to work” state, Chinese workers have stronger protections from being laid off or fired. The main downside seems to be lax enforcement of safety standards. If the government doesn’t notice something unsafe on its own, there isn’t a Chinese version of dropping a hint to OSHA.
Now further upstream in the supply chain? No thanks. That’s where you’ll find abysmal working conditions. Just remember there are good reasons our government wants us to believe everything sucks for workers in China.
Oh yes, and even plum union jobs for floor workers in Windsor or Brampton can be kind of shit too, especially in some of the parts factories.
I expect that from hypercapitalist oligarch-run societies. I don’t expect it from vanguard countries. It’s a betrayal.
Good news, the Vanguard are just capitalists by another name.
Frankly, american cars could use a knockdown. Tesla was our only real hope, and we would have glided into a strong Tesla and EV empire if conservative dems didn’t bail out GM, Chrysler, and Ford. Additionally, Tesla wouldn’t have been in a position to get bought by a dumb nazi.
I’d say, let their stuff in. Lets get some good cheap and subsidizes vehicles from China on the condition that they don’t raise car prices by more than 2% a year.
American companies will more than likely fall on their face and hopefully die. Making room for a new american car company to take their place.
And yet even at 2-3x the price, the Chinese EVs provide a better value than the handful of the American options they would compete against.
This SUV would be competing with the likes of a high end EV option like Lucid or Tesla. The Lucid Gravity starts a around $70k, and the Tesla Model X (now discontinued) was around $92k.
The Xiaomi SU7 (the car the Ford CEO has driven since 2024, despite being banned in the US) starts at $32k and clearly is targeted to compete the Porsche Taycan at $112k.
The vehicle in this article has heated floors, a projector, a pop-up roof, a fridge, swiveling seats, and over 1,000 miles of range. Functions western companies consider “luxury” are basically just standard in the Chinese market like heated and ventilated seats. They don’t even bother to advertise things like that because it’s a minimum expectation. There are zero western options that come close to something like that. The options available in the US suck, even taking industry subsidies into account.
heated floors, a projector, a pop-up roof, a fridge, swiveling seats,
Never have I once thought I needed any of that bullshit.
it seems to want it to be like a compact RV rather than a SUV
because all of those does sound like something you want in an RV
And yet there it is, along with basically every other “luxury” feature western companies save for high end models… all for the price of a base model SUV here.
Those aren’t luxury car features (minus the fridge), those are camper van features lol
The point is that what western car companies consider “luxury” features they charge extra for, like heated seats and that sort of thing, are basically standard there. So the luxury features they include to separate these models from the pack are these more niche things.
High-end EV options
Ok
like Tesla
…fucking WHAT?
I see you forget about the first 3 models that Tesla made that were $70k or higher when they were discontinued, and all launched at $90k+
They were only high-end EVs because the EV market was dogshit then. They’ve never competed with high-end cars in general.
Unfortunately it’s a race to the bottom and high-end cars are doing the same Tesla bullshit of a minimalist interior with a huge display instead of physical buttons with heft like they used to.
Oh yeah, because US car companies are NOT subsidized at all /s
Both statements can be true at the same time. But the scale of one is many times larger.
China’s MO from rare earths and magnets to cars to silicon follows the same plan. Take IP, Subsidize the industry, Research, once you have a monopoly use it to squeeze adversaries.
I will say at least China is willing to kill off underperforming companies.
The US needs to let a lot of legacy companies that aren’t performing die off. It also needs to break up oligopolies in many industries. Why compete when you can buy up the future competitors and set prices with a handful of competitors. The financialization of our economy is choking us.
Sure, but try launching a new auto startup here. It’s a lot harder than in China.
Wrong. US manufacturers have effectively been shut out of China. But not before they made investments that China basically stole.
Who would want a US made car?
Even Americans don’t want them.
I worked in the government for a bit, national park service if it matters, we were only allowed to use US made vehicles.
Constant recalls, constant breakdowns, overall unreliable. These were all vehicles that were less than 5 years okd
I have a 2007 toyota today that refuses to die and has barely needed any work. I’ll probably have it at least another 3 to 5 years at this rate.
American cars are shit
Worked at an oil refinery in the US. All the company cars were Ford. They all had various issues such as lights not working, the reverse beeper not working, constant engine light. We would get a loaner ford to replace our fleet ford and the loaner would fucking die. It would be comical if it wasn’t my safety being jeopardized.
American capitalism has rendered companies incapable of producing anything that’s not crap at a scale because they need to maximise profit at all costs, while quality doesn’t mean shit. Every company is Boeing.
It’s very possible your Toyota was made in the US.
Depends on what you mean by American. Most assume you are referring to Ford or GM. But Tesla and Rivian are US made. Many are built in the States by non US companies. BMW, Volvo, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, Hyundai, Kia.
Tesla is a toxic brand due to Elon.
I love the idea of Rivian but they don’t want to sell in Australia and the R1/R2 have too steep/bulldozer blade of a front to sell in EU (no pedestrian rollup protection)
Tesla and Rivian are US made
Chinese batteries and many parts from Canada and Mexico.
The dumb ones do
effectively been shut out of China.
Because Chinese won’t buy massive thirsty trucks. Wtf…Tesla was in China before they even started making EVs.
There’s a lot of protectionism going on in China, most western manufacturers aren’t allowed to sell their own cars without a Chinese company owning the majority of the partnership. Most countries don’t really have rules like that, China is kinda unique.
The Chinese actually LOVE big cars. Every other European manufacturer makes long wheelbase versions of their midrange sedans for China exclusively. Space in the back is a status symbol more than comfort up front apparently. And there are a ton of big Chinese crossovers out now. I won’t call them SUVs because they’re not really off road capable, much like most western “SUVs” aren’t these days.
Where does https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Tesla,_Inc. say Tesla was in China first?
The thing is, if the American government wants to be protectionist against Chinese cars, IMHO they need to pass legally binding legislation to force US car manufacturers to meet or exceed what the Chinese cars are offering and then directly subsidize the cost of those vehicles to the consumer, freely, with no stipulations. The punishment for failure to meet and exceed those expectations should be bankruptcy through immediate removal of the protectionist mechanisms.
They tried when Japanese cars became popular for being efficient, the US car companies preferred to pretty much abandon the rest of the world and keep the government money.
The US is too busy licking other corps boots. They do not have enough funds to do it for everyone.
They’d probably need to tax the rich a significant amount of money to do that.
So you think the entire world’s auto manufacturers outside of China are incompetent and inefficient? People always act like the only vehicles sold in the US are domestic brands when they don’t even make up a majority here.
Well, in Germany VW (the second largest automobile manufacturer in the world) now is laying off a significant portion of their employees, closing factories and even selling them off to US/Israeli weapons manufacturers. Their head also already signaled VW is being open to switch to weapons manufacturing. Pretty sure other German brands are in similar peril.
Traditional manufacturers are dead.
You mean Volks “we don’t even make an effort for our cars to obbey emission rules and instead we cheated” wagen is having trouble staying afloat?!
I wonder how such a high quality company which was not at all doing funny business and using political connections is having trouble competing with those who just offer better products at lower prices …
Volkswagen has made a ton of dumb mistakes, but among the worst are paying union wages and not getting super cheap lithium batteries from being located in a country that has a well integrated supply chain.
We don’t want to mine or refine lithium as much in the EU because “boohoo muh environment” but really, if we want to compete with China we can’t let the environment be a deciding factor. Mine and refine all the resources we need instead of buying them from China and letting them dictate the prices. China doesn’t give a fuck about small issues standing in its way and neither should we.
“We can’t let the environment be a deciding factor” is a preposterous take. There’s practically nothing more important that preserving the environment. Even the Chinese are looking beyond their borders for raw materials these days. If it costs more to extract raw materials in a way that doesn’t fuck up the environment, then subsidize it and pay for it. We can fund the subsidies with a carbon tax.
It’s not a preposterous take for China. They do whatever it takes to win and it shows. Lower wages, less considerations for the environment, etc.
Everything we care about has a cost. If we want the cheapest possible EVs, which most people here seem to want, then we need to ignore everything else. So you decide. Do you want super cheap EVs, or do you want good working conditions and limited pollution? And if it’s the latter, tariffs on Chinese EVs make sense because they do not adhere by the same rules.
I want the latter, and tariffs are not the only way go about protectionism. There is also subsidization, which is how the US has maintained its defense and agriculture industries. If we want stuff made domestically, we’re going to have to pay for it. Subsidies are generally preferable to tariffs because they can be paid through progressive taxation instead of regressive taxes on consumers.
They chose to actively ignore EV technology. Despite 80-100 years of manufacturing , they got overtaken by China in just 15 years.
Corrupted by the oil industry and colluding together would be a better term. Someone please stop China, they are destroying the “EVs are luxury vehicles only” gimmick.
Well I wouldn’t say they’re all incompetent but look at how glacial all the “traditional” car companies have become. These guys are innovating at a speed never seen before while your traditional car manufacturers are stumbling over themselves trying to keep up.
On the german side, just take a look at BMW and how long it took for them to come up with a competent electric platform. They just got their first car on a good platform (the new X3). Mercedes still doesn’t have a good EV, and neither does Audi. Their etron is outdated.
Moving to the Japanese brands. I know Toyota isn’t focused on EVs at all and their hybrid is top notch so they’re one of the better ones out there. But no one else is even close. Not in terms of value for money. Not in terms of tech.
The only ones that get close are Tesla because, like the Chinese, they’re running their car companies like tech companies and not car companies.
What innovations are lacking specifically? I dont know of any features unique to Chinese brands. It seems more like you think every company should only be selling EVs for dirt cheap prices, but that isn’t realistic becausw those aren’t real prices and EVs aren’t yet practical for everyone which is why they make up such a small percentage of sales here still (though this number climbs with each quarter).
They’ve been banned lol, like for decades
Claps to some of the people here thinking Mainland China is “perfection”.
Looks kind of ugly and spies on you.
And your Western-made car doesn’t? Ha!
Ew western car. I drive a japenese car
Everything spies on you now LOL.
If you’re reading this on your phone, guess what? Your phone is spying on you. Turn off your phone and watch some TV. Your TV is spying on you.
Yeah, but not everything is wankpanzer that has a much higher kill rate than reasonably designed cars.
Dumb TV no spy
